Size of DLC packs - Vintage Shrinkage!

Personally, I have had more fun creating with the vintage pack than any of the other DLC... Not saying it's better than the others, but it definitely sparked my interest into tinkering again.

First coaster I ever went on was the Big Dipper at Blackpool Pleasure Beach - nostalgia eh? Cried all the way round too.. but I was only seven... or maybe I was12 [where is it]
 
How about instead of comparing each of the individual DLCs to each other, we compare the base game to the combined total of all the DLCs? Are the total of all DLCs combined worth more than the base game?

I'd like to see how many people say yes that the combined total of DLCs are worth more than the price of the base game... And I'm not talking just about scenery pieces or flat rides, I'm talking everything in the game including scenarios

My answer is no, absolutely not. The DLCs IN MY OPINION are not worth the price they are asking for them. I'd rather wait for a true sequel at a proper price point instead of these silly miniDLCs. And I personally do not count the updates as "free DLCs" because updates are part of the base games price as if I was a new player who just purchased the game today... some people even got the game on sale for under $10 so why would I pay $10 for a single DLC if were stricly talking about base game price vs DLC

The only reason people are willing to pay for miniDLCs over a full sequel/expansion is because its easier to justify spending a few dollars here and there versus a lump sum payment... and on top of that PlanCo has no real competition since RCTW turned out the way it did (and we could even speculate how the "failure" of RCTW was a great huge publicity stunt to make planco look better and have more diehard fans)
 
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The only reason people are willing to pay for miniDLCs over a full sequel/expansion is because its easier to justify spending a few dollars here and there...
But that's also not true for everyone. I personally have no need to justify anything at all to myself or anyone else in this case.. I buy it because I want it, and for me personally I'd rather have access to new content every couple of months rather than to wait for a year - or more - for a full expansion pack.

I read the angst here that builds every few weeks when they haven't heard word on what's coming next and the then building rampant speculation as to what it could be, I can only imagine what it would be like if there were months and months of it building while waiting for a yearly or so full expansion pack! LOL!

The thought that the price paid fr all the dlc adds up to a certain amount compared to the base game doesn't even come up for some of us, I frankly don't really care in this instance. I personally don't feel the cost has been outlandish, and for me I've no problem paying it for what I feel I'm getting out of it as it's not just about piece counts for me, it's about the enjoyment value. That's certainly not true for everyone, of course, but for some of us it is,. We all have different spending habits and views on what we get out of the game and any additional items purchased.

So, for me, I'm perfectly fine with the occasional dlc releases, along with bug fixes and a few free items on the updates. I'm also fine with the price being charged for it, based on what I personally get out of this game. I realize others feel differently, and I respect that.

(and we could even speculate how the "failure" of RCTW was a great huge publicity stunt to make planco look better and have more diehard fans)
Please! No more conspiracy theories! We have enough in the world outside of planco! [haha]

(and you know someone will probably start believing that because you posted it! LOL!)
 
"The only reason people are willing to pay for miniDLCs over a full sequel/expansion is because its easier to justify spending a few dollars here and there..."
But that's also not true for everyone.
thank you for focusing and only answering the one part of my argument you can actually say I was wrong about, simply because I spoke for "everyone". However, your choice to buy anything/everything Frontier released doesnt change the fact that the combined total for DLCs are steep in price when compared to the base game in full

I'd rather have access to new content every couple of months rather than to wait for a year - or more - for a full expansion pack.
Thats kind of my point, and I think your not understanding why I am against it. Full expansions require higher quality production values IMO. Its like gambling, its easier to put in a little with the hopes of getting just a little extra in return, compared to mortgaging your house and hoping you dont bust


Please! No more conspiracy theories! We have enough in the world outside of planco! [haha]
(and you know someone will probably start believing that because you posted it! LOL!)
I'm not the only one who believes what I said, I've talked to many fans of this game about that, and while not everybody will agree, it is hard to at least not consider the possibility. Either way its still true that PlanCo has no competition and the only competition that it did have just handed the game over to Frontier and basically stole all the money from anybody who bought RCTW... I honestly think Atari should have a class action law suit filed against them for marketing/selling RCTW the way they did, but I digress lol [tongue]

#Gamersarepeopletoo#GamersMatter
 
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Personally, I have had more fun creating with the vintage pack than any of the other DLC
And that's what matters in the end. Still, there's no harm in analysing the packs in terms of quantity. In theory you would have *even more* fun if there were 100 more pieces in the pack!

Are the total of all DLCs combined worth more than the base game?
...
The DLCs IN MY OPINION are not worth the price they are asking for them
...
updates are part of the base games price as if I was a new player who just purchased the game today
There's a few people who don't like DLCs, and have their reasons. I respect those reasons, and don't want to even begin attempting to disqualify those reasons. There may be a couple of points worth submitting, however.

The first point is the notion of *supporting the game*. Simplistic, sure, but It's more than a casual pleasantry. There's constant pressure in business to make people and products accountable. We've all seen Google drop products that lots of people used, because "1 million" active users wasn't enough. So they kill their own product, weather the storm of protest, and move on. We wouldn't expect Frontier to do that considering they seem invested and emotionally connected to the game, and they're not a global tech giant with too many products!

On your point about new players paying for the current state of the game, including all updates we've received to date. Keep in mind that the support I mentioned above *feeds in* to a strong product that attracts new players. It's a snowballing effect where everyone plays their part. In return, in theory, the game gives you satisfaction and even secondary fuel for your social media or youtube popularity - which some consider currency.

I'm not pretending I know the economics and publishing strategies behind it all, I'm just a guy at the end of an internet connection. But I'm pretty sure that *support* is a reasonable factor when deciding whether DLC is worth it. After all, the game is not a public utility like electricity. You don't *need* Planet Coaster!, and nobody *needs* to make it either.

Whether all DLC combined are worth more than the base game, is really reducing things down to dollars and cents, even more so that my reduction of things down to scenery quantity. The *value* of the base game can't be too high because that's a barrier for new players. All I can say is, for dedicated players spending 100s of hours in the game, buying all main DLCs is a must. For casual players, it's worth buying at least one DLC according to what theme you like. Good luck.
 
Hey red, thanks for the response! Obviously your the OP here, but are you simply playing devils advocate? I'm not sure which side your debating against, but I'm assuming you prefer the small DLCs but wish they were a little bigger? I would say that is fair, and I am from a similar perspective, but I am also hoping for a sequel/expansion to go alongside the current DLCs.

The first point is the notion of *supporting the game*.
Again, I feel as though your simply acting as a mediator in the middle ground. I mean, I understand your saying it as though that is how "some" people feel. But isnt that why a lot of people pre-ordered, paid extra for less features during alpha, and paid extra for VIP? If people want to "support" frontier, cant they simply donate, or buy a t-shirt? I think that when a game is good, it should stand on that ground alone to become a global mass hit.

new players paying for the current state of the game, including all updates we've received to date. Keep in mind that the support I mentioned above *feeds in* to a strong product that attracts new players. It's a snowballing effect where everyone plays their part.
Theres games I enjoy from the 90s that I consider better than todays games, and they still sell on digital marketplaces and theres even situations where people(including myself) purchase games multiple times for whatever reason. But its up to the game to be strong for that to happen. In the case of PlanCo its like they are just squeezing players for every penny. Im not trying to say Im going poor or anything, but compared to other games, its very difficult to get my friends/family to play PlanCo as they would prefer something more like RCT3, and thats just the experience I continue to have with this game for the past 2 years.

Will PlanCo still be a "playable" game in 15-20 years? Will something better come along? Will PlanCo2/3/4 be backward-compatible with our current workshop creations? Or will a game like RCT3 Remastered in HD be more successful/popular?

In return, in theory, the game gives you satisfaction and even secondary fuel for your social media or youtube popularity - which some consider currency.
this is tough because IMO its a different topic of discussion. Many people get angry about the fact that a handful of people have essentially "cornered" the market of making profitable youtube videos, I mean my primary source of Ride PoVs comes from Jonny5Alive. However, I am not trying to get into that discussion, because I honestly dont care. But it does happen with a lot of games these days.

But I'm pretty sure that *support* is a reasonable factor when deciding whether DLC is worth it. After all, the game is not a public utility like electricity. You don't *need* Planet Coaster!, and nobody *needs* to make it either.
Well personally, Im a hardcore gamer. Ive played thousands of games and theres a few dozen that I play at a highly skilled level (not this one, I suck at this one) but I still enjoy PlanCo from more of a spectators perspective. I enjoy seeing other peoples creations, and luckily for me I can do that without paying. So, my perspective and stance on the game around here, is to speak for those who dont play the game, casuals.

Whether all DLC combined are worth more than the base game, is really reducing things down to dollars and cents, even more so that my reduction of things down to scenery quantity.
Fair point, but I'm surprised you as the OP would say this.

The *value* of the base game can't be too high because that's a barrier for new players. All I can say is, for dedicated players spending 100s of hours in the game, buying all main DLCs is a must. For casual players, it's worth buying at least one DLC according to what theme you like. Good luck.
Now, I understand and agree with what you just said, but at the same time its not a valid argument here, as many sequels to games have been made and were very successful without requiring any worry of "bridging the barrier to introducing new players". Like with JWE there was no conern for bringing in new players.

Infact, I could argue that small addons limit the number of sales rather than drawing in new players. It comes down to who is buying, because new players dont look at the DLC and think "wow the game is so much bigger/better now" they think "oh its more of the same" so the DLCs really mainly sell to those who already are looking for more of the same. New players dont buy all the DLCs at once (usually unless maybe its on sale) its like going to a Lego store you pick out a few pieces to start and then either you fall in love or you get bored.

Look at JWE that game is receiving bad reviews but is selling on name alone, similar to RCTW. But imagine if JWE had been an expansion to PlanCo. IMO the primary focus of concern here is whether or not the devs can release content that is backward-compatible with the steam work shop, ie. can they make a full sequel such as PlanCo2 or Planet Safari without restarting the workshop? And until I get an answer to that question, I wont buy any small DLCs

Thank you :)
 
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I think the price for this DLC is fair... very fair, and I haven't even used a single vintage piece yet other than the amazing VFX we got. A thread about DLC will pop up every 3 months but the answer on should/shouldn't buy is always the same, its worth as much as you think its worth.


I think just going off object count as well is a bit weak. Yes studios had alot more, but how much of that alot more was 10 lines in the scenery tab of animatronics? Same goes for Adventure and spooky which is "inflated" by variants of the pieces, or cut up pieces. This same thought process applies to the cut up skeletons into bones, and the different sizes of pumpkins - all of this inflates those numbers.

I don't see much repetition in Vintage at all, and its clear that the value budget shifted in this one away from scenery and into the rides. I have no problem with this, I've been a really big fan of vintage after a previous one didn't resonate with me. Similarly there will be people who don't feel like they want this one, this is fine.


At the end of the day people will vote for their wallets, I see full value of my purchase of spooky in just the wooden textures, I see the value for adventure in the just foliage, I see the value of studios in just the two chain link fence pieces. People will get the packs for different reasons and the number of objects in the pack will never be a priority over peoples desire to use the pieces inside.



Personally vintage is the favourite of the bunch so far for me, I love the detail on the rides. I was pleasantly surprised to see that Frontier had leveled up their detail and texture game for this pack, give me this every single time if it means thats its a battle between quality/quantity.

- Zakman
 
My problems with current dlcs is that they don't push the game forward at all, they just add content on the base that is a bit broken and could get much better. Free updates that go along with dlcs are apparently not enough and they are actually getting smaller.
 
I would like to see the Gravitron in Planet Coaster. It is in RCT3, Parkitect, and in RCTW, it is called Gravity Flux. Out of four coaster games, PC is the only one without a Gravitron. I bought all the DLC’s because I don’t want to miss out on any of the content and I want to be able to use things from the workshop that have dlc items in them. And because the game felt incomplete, the DLC’s make the game bigger and add more rides to the game. There are still coasters and flat rides that are missing that we had in RCT3.
 
. . . Number of scenery and building items per pack:

Spooky: 345
Adventure: 485
Studios: 419
Vintage: 238
This surprised me, because the Vintage pack seems so much bigger! So I took a look, and I think what's causing that is pretty much down to one thing: flexi-color.

Every single Scenery piece has at least one flexi-color option, the vast majority have at least three. With the exception of the Victorian Painted Banners, every single Building piece has at least one flexi-color option, the vast majority have at least two.

Previous DLCs have IMHO been more notable for the frustrating absence of flexi-color options on things that so obviously should've had 'em. Not a problem with the Vintage Pack! [up]
 
thank you for focusing and only answering the one part of my argument you can actually say I was wrong about, simply because I spoke for "everyone".
I wasn't aware that I was required to respond point-by-point, put I'll keep that in mind! [haha]

I actually didn't answer based only because of any idea of speaking for 'everyone' at all. I was disagreeing with you because I simply have a different opinion on the overall topic and you made the claim 'that the only reason...', so I gave you others, and I responded to the idea that the only reason people are okay with buying dlc is because its easier to justify spending a few dollars here and there. I simply said that I don't have a need to justify anything at all, I buy it because I want it. That's all. This isn't personal, let's please don't make it so, I have no problems with your posts or opinions, but we all get to respond if whether we agree or not, do we not? I certainly responded to the idea the price for dlc was too high as well, so I really wasn't just focused on one thing.

However, your choice to buy anything/everything Frontier released doesnt change the fact that the combined total for DLCs are steep in price when compared to the base game in full
But it's still your opinion, as you clearly stated before, that the combined total for the dlc is steep, so it's not actually a 'fact' at all. Some people are of the opinion that the price so far has been acceptable for the content provided, and I'm one of those people. The only actual 'fact' here is that people can, and will disagree on that! LOL!

Thats kind of my point, and I think your not understanding why I am against it. Full expansions require higher quality production values IMO. Its like gambling, its easier to put in a little with the hopes of getting just a little extra in return, compared to mortgaging your house and hoping you dont bust
Fair enough, I do get your point, but I'm of the opinion that the dlc that has come out so far for this game has of the same high production values as the base game, so I'm not convinced that holding off for one large full expansion will guarantee anything one way or the other. Could it? Certainly, but we simply have no way of knowing that, and I'm not sure we've seen any sign that would be true. Can we look to what happened with other instances? Sure, but again that's still just an guess, an educated one it may well be. But personally I look forward to seeing what they come up with every couple of months, and so far I haven't been really disappointed myself. Others state they are, but I only speak for myself here.

I'm not rebutting your desire for focusing on a larger expansion rather than more frequent dlc packs. I can understand your reasoning, I'm certainly not saying that you are wrong. I'm simply saying that for myself I have reasons why I support dlc as they are, and I look at the issue from another angle. That's all.

I'm not the only one who believes what I said, I've talked to many fans of this game about that, and while not everybody will agree, it is hard to at least not consider the possibility. Either way its still true that PlanCo has no competition and the only competition that it did have just handed the game over to Frontier and basically stole all the money from anybody who bought RCTW... I honestly think Atari should have a class action law suit filed against them for marketing/selling RCTW the way they did, but I digress lol [tongue]
We totally agree about Atari - maybe not the conspiracy theory part, but certainly everything else! [wink]
 
i like the idea of a "only flat ride dlc" too ... that would awesome Frontier if we have this in the future...you have so great designers to manage this ;)
 
I oersonally believe that $11 is a good asking amount for each PC DLC. You spend about that much at a cheap resturant a lot more often than the few times a year that a dlc is released. Try not to think of all the dlc's combined as costing more than the base game.
 
Try not to think of all the dlc's combined as costing more than the base game.
Try not to think... yea I dont think so [wink] whether it "sounds good" or its something you dont want to "think about" doesnt change the fact that the base game is actually worth $45 but the DLC is not quite worth $55 along with the continuing increase each few months. Especially if we are to consider players who have not purchased the game yet. I suppose its fine for those who have played the game consistently since launch, but most new players dont get excited about the DLC for this game, or at least IMO it wouldnt seem as if the Vintage pack is a big draw for new players. Most games come down in price after they are 2-3 years old, and the only reason PlanCo gets away with it is due to having little to no competition (as we already discussed) but that could start to change in another year or 2.
 
There are lots of games with paid add ons. Train Simulator by Dovetail has all these payware routes and trains, you could easily spend $200 at one shot for three routes and several trains. In that light, PC is a good deal.
 
I thought this pack was OK. The new flats and bobsled are great so that's worth it to me alone. I was disappointed in the animatronics & was hoping for another wall/roof set and some new windows/doors, the striped metal walls are OK. I love the new marque letters and mini stalls. Would have loved to have seen that clown king coaster! I also set myself up for hype when I saw that picture of the carousel horse & I thought we were going to get a larger carousel. [knockout]
 
But that's also not true for everyone. I personally have no need to justify anything at all to myself or anyone else in this case.. I buy it because I want it, and for me personally I'd rather have access to new content every couple of months rather than to wait for a year - or more - for a full expansion pack.
I prefer this too, honestly.
 
I don't have any problem buying those DLCs, but I can agree that the price is pretty high. When you think that all DLC content released so far cost more than the main game, for less content, I think the DLCs are undersized, or too expensive.
However, I have the money to buy them, so I buy them, but a lower price would be a better representation of what they are : small content packs.
 
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