Frontier

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  1. #1

    Frontier

    The title says it all, does Frontier ever listen to our complaints/suggestions? Because some basic features that should be in the game and shouldn't be a problem to code is still not in the game. For example, the "close park" button. Sure it closes the park, but rides, stalls, basically everything that is inside the park remains open; why? That doesn't make any sense why is there no button that closes everything? It's very tedious to have to go through and individually close all of your rides/attractions that are in your park.

    Likewise, janitors, they're just plain terrible, even when creating a roster where you want them to stay in specific part of the park or permanently at the exit of a ride and yet they still don't clean up the trash on the paths. Also, why do janitors and other roaming staff members always group up and roam together? I saw a herd of janitors like 9 of them bunch together like flamingos as they walk around the park, why are they so buggy? Along with this, in rct3, you could easily pick up a staff member and place them anywhere in the park but in this game there is no simple "pickup" button accessible from the staff management page, why? It makes it really annoying when you see a mess that you want a janitor to clean but you can't just go to the park management tab and pick them up to move them to that specific location.

    These are just a few examples of basic mechanics that should be in the game but isn't, and there's even more excellent points about basic things/improvements that this game should have but doesn't..and don't even get me started with the lag in the game when your park gets big. When you're playing in sandbox mode, the fun part about it is having large amounts of people in your park with a plethora of attractions for them to occupy their time with, but what's the point of getting that big and exploiting the sandbox mode to it's full potential if the game is literally not capable of running the game smoothly because of how much stress guest put on this game. I created a realistic park with a good mix of flat rides, stalls, scenery, etc with 26 roller coaster both big boy and kiddy rides and usually getting about 16k people consistently. It's really rewarding seeing how it is my very first park that I have been adding on to for about the 2 months that I've had this game but I can't really enjoy it when the game is running like it's the offspring of Internet Explorer that's stuck in traffic in NYC.

    Does Frontier even listen to our complaints or do they just ignore our most requested needs and wants that shouldn't be hard to implement?

  2. #2
    Yes Frontier listens to the community. We have seen a lot of changes / additions that were really community driven, especially during the last few updates.

    This doesn't mean they (can) follow up on all community requests. I agree with you that some changes seem very easy but be very cautious with that as sometimes the devil is in the details why something is difficult to do. If certain changes are really that easy, and a lot of fans request is then there is no reason why Frontier wouldn't pick the low hanging fruits as fast as possible. The fact they don't suggests its either not that heavily requested or not as easy to do as you might think. (Or it gets pushed down the list as there is even lower hanging fruit)

    On the open/close button i can see your point, it doesn't seem like a difficult thing to do (But only Frontier knows for sure) There have been more then one requests for this on the request forums so i would say make your opinion known there and maybe we will see the feature one day. They added a lot of smaller QOL changes during the last few updates.

    As for the lag, i can agree it's very annoying and make big parks difficult to play. However keep in mind what the alternatives would be. The game would be in way lower quality or they could cap the maximum number of guests. Both options are a really big no to me. There is no easy fix for this and personally im very glad Frontier made no concessions at quality. Fortunatly it will only get better in the future as hardware will catch up.

  3. #3
    Originally Posted by Vampiro View Post (Source)
    Yes Frontier listens to the community. We have seen a lot of changes / additions that were really community driven, especially during the last few updates.

    This doesn't mean they (can) follow up on all community requests. I agree with you that some changes seem very easy but be very cautious with that as sometimes the devil is in the details why something is difficult to do. If certain changes are really that easy, and a lot of fans request is then there is no reason why Frontier wouldn't pick the low hanging fruits as fast as possible. The fact they don't suggests its either not that heavily requested or not as easy to do as you might think. (Or it gets pushed down the list as there is even lower hanging fruit)

    On the open/close button i can see your point, it doesn't seem like a difficult thing to do (But only Frontier knows for sure) There have been more then one requests for this on the request forums so i would say make your opinion known there and maybe we will see the feature one day. They added a lot of smaller QOL changes during the last few updates.

    As for the lag, i can agree it's very annoying and make big parks difficult to play. However keep in mind what the alternatives would be. The game would be in way lower quality or they could cap the maximum number of guests. Both options are a really big no to me. There is no easy fix for this and personally im very glad Frontier made no concessions at quality. Fortunatly it will only get better in the future as hardware will catch up.
    I agree with you.

    Only I would have said it differently.

    "This doesn't mean they (need to) follow up on all community requests."

    But being able to instantly close all shops and all rides would be a nice feature.

    As for staff, I don't experience any real trouble. But the "herding" is caused by them flocking on trash piles as the game does not queue a job in their work schedule. They just do one job and then when done check for a new job. If they are closer to a trash pile than a janitor that is on its way to that trash pile, they will take over, but the janitor on its way will only know when the other one starts the job (what a pain to explain this is, I hope you understand). I'm not sure if they can do something about this, as similar behaviour has also been the case in older games.

    The lag depends on so many factors, I don't have a great machine but then I don't have real lag issues. There are so many variables in play for this.
    I think a lot of people have a misperception of what their machine is capable of. I doubt this will ever improve, but like Vampiro says, hardware can become better.

  4. #4
    Examples of things requested by the community from Alpha onwards that were implemented include:


    • Option of removal of kerb from path
    • Option of removal of railings on path
    • Option to toggle security features, staff features
    • Option to turn off scenery/terrain collision
    • Time machine option on triggers
    • Custom music (aka the Vampiro feature )
    • Ability to set a max number of guests in the park for performance improvement
    • Art shapes
    • Custom search filter tags
    • Improved categories in the UI for objects (a work in progress)
    • Changes to whether certain coasters have launch and non launch options
    • Ability to change some coaster trains and tracked ride vehicles to other tracks
    • Less heavily themed rides (though I would personally like some more)
    • More Glass
    • Billboard functionality
    • Bigger maps
    • Custom terrain options (as in selecting the paints you want, as a workaround of the technical limitation)
    • More pieces in a blueprint (originally it was 1000, then 2000 -> present count)
    • More staff management
    • Picnic benches
    • Less heavily themes pieces
    • Existing heavily themed pieces broken apart
    • Extra pieces for existing scenery sets that make building with less pieces easier (more columns was one I remember well)
    • Ability to make plazas and the gridded path feature. This was begged for and they were not sure if they could deliver, but they did.
    • Path tunnelling
    • Triggerable lights
    • Improved trigger options
    • Better filter options in UI for filtering blueprints (Frontier/Yourself/Workshop)
    • More female entertainers
    • Colourable staff
    • Hotels/Restaurants
    • Autumn trees
    • Options to recolour items that were not originally recolourable
    • More colourable flora
    • Changes to the advanced move tool, additional copy and merge objects options
    • Tegidcam cheat
    • Press L for torch
    • Mayo as an extra for fries (this was a big deal at the time)
    • kerbs and barriers for crowd control
    • vending machines
    • Fireworks and improvements to the tool to create triggered displays (there is more feedback that hasn't been taken on board for now, but I expect it is time consuming)
    • More female animatronics
    • More flags
    • Certain sound effects
    • Dark rides
    • Certain rides that were heavily requested
    • Removal of archway on ride entrance
    • Ability to automatically select the placement of the ride entrance (1 less click than before)
    • Fast pass system



    Note: this is not an exhaustive list, and just things I remember from being in the forums, on the streams and from my competition win to visit Frontier. As mods, we read most things and are on most livestreams moderating so we hear/see a lot. Suggestions are usually noted, but it is a matter of priority or feasibility.
    - Planet Coaster - - Harry Potter - - Crafts - - Coding -

  5. #5
    And the #passion award goes to WingardiumLevicoaster

  6. This is the last staff post in this thread. #6
    Yes, we're always listening and reviewing the feedback our community share with us. As has been highlighted above, we've introduced a lot of changes and improvements based on the stuff you all shared with us. If you think there is something missing then by all means share it constructively with us so we can make sure the development team have the best information to review

  7. #7
    Originally Posted by WingardiumLevicoaster View Post (Source)
    Examples of things requested by the community from Alpha onwards that were implemented include:


    • Option of removal of kerb from path
    • Option of removal of railings on path
    • Option to toggle security features, staff features
    • Option to turn off scenery/terrain collision
    • Time machine option on triggers
    • Custom music (aka the Vampiro feature )
    • Ability to set a max number of guests in the park for performance improvement
    • Art shapes
    • Custom search filter tags
    • Improved categories in the UI for objects (a work in progress)
    • Changes to whether certain coasters have launch and non launch options
    • Ability to change some coaster trains and tracked ride vehicles to other tracks
    • Less heavily themed rides (though I would personally like some more)
    • More Glass
    • Billboard functionality
    • Bigger maps
    • Custom terrain options (as in selecting the paints you want, as a workaround of the technical limitation)
    • More pieces in a blueprint (originally it was 1000, then 2000 -> present count)
    • More staff management
    • Picnic benches
    • Less heavily themes pieces
    • Existing heavily themed pieces broken apart
    • Extra pieces for existing scenery sets that make building with less pieces easier (more columns was one I remember well)
    • Ability to make plazas and the gridded path feature. This was begged for and they were not sure if they could deliver, but they did.
    • Path tunnelling
    • Triggerable lights
    • Improved trigger options
    • Better filter options in UI for filtering blueprints (Frontier/Yourself/Workshop)
    • More female entertainers
    • Colourable staff
    • Hotels/Restaurants
    • Autumn trees
    • Options to recolour items that were not originally recolourable
    • More colourable flora
    • Changes to the advanced move tool, additional copy and merge objects options
    • Tegidcam cheat
    • Press L for torch
    • Mayo as an extra for fries (this was a big deal at the time)
    • kerbs and barriers for crowd control
    • vending machines
    • Fireworks and improvements to the tool to create triggered displays (there is more feedback that hasn't been taken on board for now, but I expect it is time consuming)
    • More female animatronics
    • More flags
    • Certain sound effects
    • Dark rides
    • Certain rides that were heavily requested
    • Removal of archway on ride entrance
    • Ability to automatically select the placement of the ride entrance (1 less click than before)
    • Fast pass system



    Note: this is not an exhaustive list, and just things I remember from being in the forums, on the streams and from my competition win to visit Frontier. As mods, we read most things and are on most livestreams moderating so we hear/see a lot. Suggestions are usually noted, but it is a matter of priority or feasibility.
    My least favourite thing on this list is custom music.

  8. #8
    Originally Posted by Vampiro View Post (Source)
    And the #passion award goes to WingardiumLevicoaster

    I just have a good memory for non-essential information
    - Planet Coaster - - Harry Potter - - Crafts - - Coding -

  9. #9
    Originally Posted by sting View Post (Source)
    The title says it all, does Frontier ever listen to our complaints/suggestions? Because some basic features that should be in the game and shouldn't be a problem to code is still not in the game.
    I always like the assumptions where things "shouldn't be hard/problem to code" comes up. I don't think the majority of the people here realizes what does into making a game like this and how easy/difficult it is to change once something is in place. Not saying that everything is hard, just that the assumption should be something different. As others have already said, Frontier has listened to the community and added tons of stuff to the game based on user feedback. Maybe more than most other gaming companies. Just because your suggestions has not been implemented doesn't mean that they don't listen at all. How long have you been part of this community?

    Originally Posted by sting View Post (Source)
    These are just a few examples of basic mechanics that should be in the game but isn't, and there's even more excellent points about basic things/improvements that this game should have but doesn't..
    Again, the work should is subjective. In the end it is Frontier's game and they alone decided that they want to have in the game. Yes, they listens to the community and I believe that affects their decision making process along the road but it does not mean that they must implement what you think the game should include.

    Originally Posted by sting View Post (Source)
    ..and don't even get me started with the lag in the game when your park gets big. When you're playing in sandbox mode, the fun part about it is having large amounts of people in your park with a plethora of attractions for them to occupy their time with, but what's the point of getting that big and exploiting the sandbox mode to it's full potential if the game is literally not capable of running the game smoothly because of how much stress guest put on this game. I created a realistic park with a good mix of flat rides, stalls, scenery, etc with 26 roller coaster both big boy and kiddy rides and usually getting about 16k people consistently. It's really rewarding seeing how it is my very first park that I have been adding on to for about the 2 months that I've had this game but I can't really enjoy it when the game is running like it's the offspring of Internet Explorer that's stuck in traffic in NYC.
    What do you expect here? We all are bound to hit a wall at some point regardless of computer specs, how well the optimization is etc. Frontier has given us "unlimited" freedom when it comes to building, amount of pieces and guests etc. Nothing is stopping you from adding as many items as you want to to have as many guests in your part as you like. BUT it will come with a cost in the form or performance. At some point, that point will be different for everyone based on their computer specs, you are bound to hit a wall when the games will slow down and become sluggish. The alternative would be that they limit how many objects you can add in order to "guarantee" a smooth experience. If they did that people would complain (they already have) that the game is too limiting and they want to add more stuff. In the end, you are in control of how much you add to the park, you can even control and limit how many guests you want at any given time. What else do you expect here? If you truly believe that it is realistic for this, or any other, game to have unlimited amount of objects and guests without any slow down or trade off, then I must assume that you also believe unicorns and flying elephants exists?

  10. #10
    Originally Posted by gregorburns View Post (Source)
    My least favourite thing on this list is custom music.
    mine is the fast pass, would have much rather had the ability to allow guests to jump/cut through parts of a queue if the line is short
    PlanCo + RCTClassic Alpha VIP Thrillseeker
    Video games are not meant to mimic reality, but to exaggerate it

  11. #11
    I don't think its so much that they aren't listening, I think its more so that they want to get through a list of the on-going list of things people have requested~ though smoother coasters/coaster cam (seriously, that log flume cam each time it gets to the top of a lift hill zooms down to the knees) but yeah, I think you gotta be patient, I do think it'd be nice of Frontier posted a list of community suggestions and then highlighted each that are possible/impossible/being worked on etc.

  12. #12
    They listened to a lot of feedback (or maybe they planned that stuff all the time and we just matched with the feedback, so it makes them look they listen to us). If you are happy depends on in what "group" you belong to. I think there are two, people who enjoy building stunning stuff and people who also like some management. The second group cannot be much happy, while the first definitely yes. Even the list posted above in my eyes suggest devs really focused a lot on building, but far less on gameplay and management.

    Whatever itīs good, itīs subjective.

  13. #13
    Originally Posted by sting View Post (Source)
    The title says it all, does Frontier ever listen to our complaints/suggestions? Because some basic features that should be in the game and shouldn't be a problem to code is still not in the game. For example, the "close park" button. Sure it closes the park, but rides, stalls, basically everything that is inside the park remains open; why?
    In scenario play, it can happen that you want to close the park yet keep the rides open. There are a couple of reasons why a player might want to do this:

    Say the number of guests has not changed for several months. By now, most of the guests are broke. They just wander around, bouncing off ride entrances. The best thing that can happen (if they don't use an ATM) is to get rid of them. The fastest way to get rid of them is to close the park. However, if rides are also closed at the same time, guests in the queue or on the ride get refunds. Closing a ride when its queue is nearly empty preserves as much income from the ride as possible.

    If you want to change the park from free admission to paid admission or the other way around, this will impact the prices guests are willing to pay for rides. So guests that came in under the "old" entrance policy are probably a hindrance and kicking them out is a reasonable management approach.

  14. #14
    Originally Posted by ojonas View Post (Source)
    I always like the assumptions where things "shouldn't be hard/problem to code" comes up. I don't think the majority of the people here realizes what does into making a game like this and how easy/difficult it is to change once something is in place. Not saying that everything is hard, just that the assumption should be something different. As others have already said, Frontier has listened to the community and added tons of stuff to the game based on user feedback. Maybe more than most other gaming companies. Just because your suggestions has not been implemented doesn't mean that they don't listen at all. How long have you been part of this community?


    Again, the work should is subjective. In the end it is Frontier's game and they alone decided that they want to have in the game. Yes, they listens to the community and I believe that affects their decision making process along the road but it does not mean that they must implement what you think the game should include.



    What do you expect here? We all are bound to hit a wall at some point regardless of computer specs, how well the optimization is etc. Frontier has given us "unlimited" freedom when it comes to building, amount of pieces and guests etc. Nothing is stopping you from adding as many items as you want to to have as many guests in your part as you like. BUT it will come with a cost in the form or performance. At some point, that point will be different for everyone based on their computer specs, you are bound to hit a wall when the games will slow down and become sluggish. The alternative would be that they limit how many objects you can add in order to "guarantee" a smooth experience. If they did that people would complain (they already have) that the game is too limiting and they want to add more stuff. In the end, you are in control of how much you add to the park, you can even control and limit how many guests you want at any given time. What else do you expect here? If you truly believe that it is realistic for this, or any other, game to have unlimited amount of objects and guests without any slow down or trade off, then I must assume that you also believe unicorns and flying elephants exists?
    Not too long, I don't normally sign up for forums for games but they're actually amazing and there's usually a lot more participants on the forums than I would of thought, but yea I haven't been a part of the community for too long. When it comes to the things I mentioned earlier particularly with the coding of the open close park thing, I just figured that seeing how in other games like RCT3 I'm pretty sure, if I’m not mistaken, that's how the close park function worked. I'm also a Computer Science student in college and I've made some small apps before although not on a game of this level of course so I just figured from what I know that it shouldn't be all that hard but I of course wouldn't know because I'm not working at Frontier but it was my observation.


    I know that there would be a slow down on any game when there's a large excess of objects moving in one simulation at once, but I didn't expect it to be plain awful like it is here. I don't have an active fps counter on my laptop but I can see it's pretty bad, maybe I'm just under estimating exactly how much is going on but I do know that it's the guests that cause it. When I closed my park completely and everyone left I had no lag what so ever and then, when I opened it back up by the time it got to about 7k guests it was really choppy like it was with 16k guests. And my laptop isn't bad either, idk if any of you have played World of Tanks before, but that is a really intensive game and I'm able to run it with max everything (and there's a lot of settings) and have no lag so I just figured if I can run that game I should be able to run other games at that caliber as well.

  15. #15
    Originally Posted by sting View Post (Source)
    Not too long, I don't normally sign up for forums for games but they're actually amazing and there's usually a lot more participants on the forums than I would of thought, but yea I haven't been a part of the community for too long. When it comes to the things I mentioned earlier particularly with the coding of the open close park thing, I just figured that seeing how in other games like RCT3 I'm pretty sure, if I’m not mistaken, that's how the close park function worked. I'm also a Computer Science student in college and I've made some small apps before although not on a game of this level of course so I just figured from what I know that it shouldn't be all that hard but I of course wouldn't know because I'm not working at Frontier but it was my observation.


    I know that there would be a slow down on any game when there's a large excess of objects moving in one simulation at once, but I didn't expect it to be plain awful like it is here. I don't have an active fps counter on my laptop but I can see it's pretty bad, maybe I'm just under estimating exactly how much is going on but I do know that it's the guests that cause it. When I closed my park completely and everyone left I had no lag what so ever and then, when I opened it back up by the time it got to about 7k guests it was really choppy like it was with 16k guests. And my laptop isn't bad either, idk if any of you have played World of Tanks before, but that is a really intensive game and I'm able to run it with max everything (and there's a lot of settings) and have no lag so I just figured if I can run that game I should be able to run other games at that caliber as well.




    RCT3 also slowed down the more items you placed. Especially when playing it with the specs/Hardware that existed at the time. There are many ways to help with performance in Planet Coaster. Do not place too many pieces, limit glass, billboards and guest numbers. There is only so much that can be done by Frontier, but the wall will always be hit. Plus there is Direct X 11 limitations in performance (which most games suffer with), which at the moment still needs supporting, because so many people have not moved to Windows 10.

    With regards to being a Computer Science student! I wish you all the best. I am a software developer (business apps not games). Outside of small apps, everything becomes rather complex. Architecture of large apps (or I assume games) can make things difficult, especially when there are lots of dependencies. A small change can impact something else. Even a small feature or bug fix requires the full development process to make it into production, through many teams. Dev -> QA -> UAT -> Pre Prod -> Production. However don't let it put you off in your future career. It is fun too

    Though some of these features you mention, are probably a case of not being highest priority. They will most likely have a backlog of future features, that will be regularly prioritised based on a number of factors (ease of completion, business/marketing plans, resource available, customer demand, cost vs value). The best we can do is make suggestions on the forum and perhaps it will become a higher priority, if it is possible.
    - Planet Coaster - - Harry Potter - - Crafts - - Coding -

  16. #16
    Originally Posted by sting View Post (Source)
    idk if any of you have played World of Tanks before, but that is a really intensive game and I'm able to run it with max everything (and there's a lot of settings) and have no lag so I just figured if I can run that game I should be able to run other games at that caliber as well.
    Minimum system requirements of World of Tanks come nowhere near the system requirements of Planet Coaster.
    In my opinion it is not an intensive game to play.

    What are your system specs? do you play Planet Coaster on Ultra settings as well?

    16k guests in Planet Coaster is insane. 6-7k guests is about the max for most of us.

    And like Wingardianlevicoaster said, DirectX is probably one of the limiters here.

  17. #17
    Originally Posted by Luuknoord View Post (Source)
    Minimum system requirements of World of Tanks come nowhere near the system requirements of Planet Coaster.
    In my opinion it is not an intensive game to play.

    What are your system specs? do you play Planet Coaster on Ultra settings as well?

    16k guests in Planet Coaster is insane. 6-7k guests is about the max for most of us.

    And like Wingardianlevicoaster said, DirectX is probably one of the limiters here.

    No, I run the game on the lowest settings however the game still looks beautiful it's actually amazing. My laptop specs are:
    Intel Core i7-6700HQ, CPU @ 2.60GHz, Nvidia GeForce GTX 960M, 16 GB of Ram with my hard disk having 128 GB + 1 TB

  18. #18
    since i’m a “glass is half full” kinda person......they can’t please every single person that has bought this game. They have made a thousand improvements since I bought this game (July 2017] and I’m grateful that they DO listen. I can tolerate some inconveniences.

    Frontier: keep up the good work. Thumbs up!

  19. #19
    Originally Posted by sting View Post (Source)
    No, I run the game on the lowest settings however the game still looks beautiful it's actually amazing. My laptop specs are:
    Intel Core i7-6700HQ, CPU @ 2.60GHz, Nvidia GeForce GTX 960M, 16 GB of Ram with my hard disk having 128 GB + 1 TB
    Sounds like a good setup for higher settings. And I believe 16k guests is quite an overkill for any spec.

  20. #20
    Originally Posted by Luuknoord View Post (Source)
    Sounds like a good setup for higher settings. And I believe 16k guests is quite an overkill for any spec.
    I know, 16k guests is a lot but it's cool to see which rides (particularly roller coasters) the guests tend to go to, it just feels more realistic when the park is full.

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